What do you think of Rachel Maddow's expose on Conservative Astroturfing? See LINK & VIDEO:

It's no suprise that Mrs. Maddow can 'expose' vast right wing conspiracies at every turn. It would, however, be a suprise were she to engage in any kind of real, impartial journalistic effort and find that the vast majority of people don't want the government telling them what to do when it comes to their own healthcare. It would be a suprise for her to support the freedom for me to keep my healthcare plan instead of the government basically outlawing it when I go to change it in any way and forcing me to take their plan. It would be a suprise for her to 'expose' how much the current plan that passed the House will add to the deficit and how much it will raise taxes. Ninety percent of people have never heard of any of the organizations that she is exposing here, and those organizations have no impact on the outcome of people's opinions. It would be a HUGE SUPRISE were Maddow to choose a line of thought based on anything but liberal ideology, afterall she did come from the failed liberal talk radio "Air America". She is the liberal equivelent of Sean Hannity, entertaining to her base, informative only to those who blindly follow, and irrelevant to those who think and decide for themselves.

Comments

I expected the ad hominem approach from the right. It's the usual answer to facts they don't like -- attack the messenger. If any of the 'facts' you list about health care remorm had any basis in truth, I would be out there with the Town Hall shouters trying to stop it. Alas, it's all right-wing fiction. None of the bills proposed force anyone to switch for private insurance to the public option. In fact, the senate bill excludes 97% of Americans from the public option. Only 3% of us would even be eligible for it, and thise people could elect it or private insurance as they saw ift. It's just an option, not a mandate.
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by Jim in a Nautilus COAT on November 20th, 2009
Republicans and their Health Scare.
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by Moongrim on December 6th, 2009
Democrats and their LIES.
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by jackpipe30 on December 6th, 2009
jackpipes are known conduits of lies. Is simplistic name calling all you are capable of? I challenged you to assail Ms. Maddow's facts and that's the best you can do. Well, I'd rather not continue on with a contest to see who can craft the most sophmoric insults.
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by Jim in a Nautilus COAT on December 6th, 2009
You need to reign in your boy Moongrim, he is the one who fired the first shot, I just fired back, dickweed.
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by jackpipe30 on December 6th, 2009
Still at it, are you, jackpipe? Anyone who wishes can read back over your answer and comments above to see who started hurling insults at whom.
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by Jim in a Nautilus COAT on December 6th, 2009
Don't need to lie Jackpipe. We just pay attention to the truths the Republicans hide.
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by Moongrim on December 7th, 2009
Where is it that I started hurling insults, Jim? Anyone with half a brain can see that my answer is has no insults in it, unless you count disagreeing with you as insulting.
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by jackpipe30 on December 7th, 2009
Go elsewhere and stir shit, Moongrim you douchebag.
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by jackpipe30 on December 7th, 2009
jackpipe30,

I read your answer, and the first thing that jumped at me was your claim that your freedom to keep your current heath care was in jeopardy. what I don't understand is "from who".

currently, in North Carolina, Blue Cross/Blue Shield is raising rates by 11%. they sent out a letter to all of their insurance holders asking them to fight against a government take over of health care, claiming they would loose there "freedom"

Logic would dictate that if a person can't afford the increase, they lose there coverage. and who's fault is that? The governments?

If you look at this whole situation, in black and white, the winners in the health care debate if this health care bill does not pass will be the insurance companies, and drug companies.

because, you won't have a choice, you will have to pay what they tell you, and if they decide to drop coverage, then so be it.
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by olan black on December 7th, 2009
If you decide to move to another company that is cheaper than the one that you have then this bill will force you to take the government plan. If you decide to have a child and add them to your plan, then this bill forces you to move to the government plan. If you change jobs then this bill forces you to move to the government plan. Tell me when our government has done anything efficiently or with the interest of the individual in mind...never that's when. We must reform our system, not trash it and let the government tell us what to do. This nation is more and more of a nanny state every day.
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by jackpipe30 on December 7th, 2009
And there in lies a problem that is not being addressed.

Insurance companies have monopolies in certain regions, so there is not much competition. and among the competition, they have Oligopolies (set prices to curtail competition)sorta like the cell phone companies.

I don't think of it as a nanny state, people that receive medicare do so because they have paid into the system, same with social security.

also, something that is not discussed is the fact that many jobs don't offer health insurance, and these workers have no way of getting coverage, since they don't earn enough to buy private insurance.

In the long run, by killing the bill, in the future, people will not be able to afford health care, only the very rich will receive care, and we all lose. insurance rates will continue to go up, along with drug prices, and since medicare has been hijacked already to include private insurance, it is going to be bad for consumers.
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by olan black on December 7th, 2009
The Republicans have proposed letting insurance companies sell across state lines, but were shouted down by liberals. Medicare and social security are not nanny state things, they are benefits that have been earned, what I am talking about is the government dictating what treatment you will have and what coverage you receive. It is true that a good many jobs do not offer coverage, and those are the people that we need to work to help, instead of working to hurt the others by taking away their freedom of choice. I agree that drug prices and the cost of insurance are things that we need to rein in, but this is not the way to do it. With the government condemning the healthcare industry and taking it over how many people will lose their jobs at insurance companies? The in answer is many. How many of those jobs lost will be big time executives? That answer is not many. So, a good many jobs for WORKING PEOPLE will be lost in this garbage endeavor.
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by jackpipe30 on December 7th, 2009
The republican alternate bill has a catch 22 in it. the proposed bill would reduce premiums for people that buy private insurance, as opposed to buying it through an employer. this could reduce the number of people enrolled in an employee plan, and thus increase premiums for another group.

It also does nothing to to provide insurance to those who can't afford it, well it does, but it calls for setting up "medical insurance savings" sorta like the current 401K plans.

And the savings are expected to take place after 2016.

I think if there was a way to break up the insurance oligopolies, and have real competition, and not set price competition, it would help, but in the long run, as a capitalist system, these companies are in the business of making a profit first, and providing service second.

here is a link I found for the Republican plan:

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/washingtondc/la-na-health-gop5-2009nov05,0,2750338.story
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by olan black on December 7th, 2009
I feel like a Johnny come lately here, but will try to catch up.
@jackpipe: Your answer had plenty of Republican talking-point fear mongering in it. Not insults, but fear mongering. Claimed morbid threats which, when investigated, are totally without merit. There is no plan for the government to take over health care. There is no plan to force you into a public option. In fact, the Senate bill would limit the public option to only 1% of Americans. 99% wouldn't even be eligible for it, much less forced into it.

In response to that, Moongrim wrote, "Republicans and their Health Scare." That's not an insult. It is a fact.

Your comeback was, "Democrats and their LIES." That is an insult. So you were the first to hurl mud, my friend. It's all still there in black and white. And in this case, since you had stated things in your answer that are not true, and Moongrim gave a factual response, it is blatant projection. You are calling him and an entire party liars when it is you and your party's talking points that are untrue.

As to permitting people to buy insurance across state lines, on the surface this sounds like a great idea. It's a minefield though. The insurance cartel wants this because they will then be able to set up shop in the states with the absolute minimum of regulation and stick it to people in states that now protect their consumers from predatory practices like canceling coverage abruptly when a subscriber gets sick or denying coverage for procedures your doctor deems essential.
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by Jim in a Nautilus COAT on December 7th, 2009

Her reasearch team does great work. Thanks.
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by Jim in a Nautilus COAT on November 20th, 2009
that or they're great hypnotists ;)
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by mymoonq on November 20th, 2009
Ha! I saw that thing on the right-winger claiming Obama stole the election by mass hypnosis through the television. Stuff straight from the tinfoil-hat set!
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by Jim in a Nautilus COAT on November 20th, 2009

Actually, tominhouston, I would be willing to bet you a dollar to a doughnut that I get my news and information from a far wider range of sources than you do. I read and listen to right wing as well as left. I'm an old man with a good memory of what has been tried before and what worked. When I hear a statement that doesn't seem to jibe with what I know, I don't just reject it out of hand as you have done. I check it out to see if it might be true.

As far as what Ms. Maddow says in the show linked above, I believe it because she showed video clips of the right-wingers she was assailing and gave references to the evidence of AstroTurfing she was exposing. I can go to those references myself and see if she's telling the truth. She is.
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by Jim in a Nautilus COAT on December 6th, 2009

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What do you think of Rachel Maddow's expose on Conservative Astroturfing? See LINK & VIDEO:

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